Watch videos with subtitles in your language, upload your videos, create your own subtitles! Click here to learn more on "how to Dotsub"

Ken Wilber sobre Descartes

0 (0 Likes / 0 Dislikes)
Audience: I'm ever so glad to be someplace where I can ask a question about Descartes. (laughter) That's why I like coming to Naropa. But he, you know, when you talk about the anti- intellectual, he was just a villain. You know, ever since I came to Naropa, I mean, and before that, it's not like Naropa is the only one but it seems that you always cut him some slack, whenever I come across his name in your writing and I would just love your take on where he stands on all this form and? Yeah, again there's two, and we can sort of anchor it in Batriana and Vedanta as kind of the "Kosher" approaches, that's something that Naropa would be a little more open to. And we just went throught that version, which is: the world is illusory; Brahman, alone, is real; Brahman is the world. All three of those are important. Now the ultimate ecological stance is: Brahman is the world. That's ultimately what deep ecology is about. That's ultimately what a profound environmental orientation is. But you have to go through the other steps to get there. If you just start out aware only of the world, and claim that that's Brahman, you've missed the first part -- the world is illusory. Everything that's arising from moment is the world of form. It's transitory. It stays a bit tortures you and leaves. If you identify gaia, or spirit with gaia, then where was spirit prior to the big bang? When there was no gaia, when there was no manifestation, was there just no spirit? That doesn't quite make sense that spirt had to come into existence after the big bang. That's not an eternal or timeless spirit. So you have to have -- the whole meditative, satory awakening component, is seeing that the entire, manifest world is an illusion. It radically is just like a dream and that's why it is classically equated to -- when you have satori, you're waking up and it's very similar to you having a dream at night where it seems very very real, horrible things can be going on and then pow, you wake up and you go -- Jeez, I thought that was real and it isn't. The same thing happens with satori in the waking state. It appears real, you're really plugged into it, and all of a sudden you have one of these experiences and it shows you that there's a deeper, profounder, reality. And that is an orientation, call it satori or whatever you want, that is absolutely necessary in order to get over the "shadows in the cave", or the addiction to the fact that finite, temporary, passing phenomena are somehow equated with spirit. So once you go through the first phase, there appears to be three steps. They're not linear steps, they're just different realizations. The first is -- the world is illusory. The second is -- Brahman alone is real and that is where we are taught, Brahman here means, the witness or Atman, or pure emptiness ... you're own consciousness, which is the only thing that is unchanging, and in which, all of these objects are arising moment to moment. So that self-recognition or realization of your transcendental self anchors that unchanging reality which is pure spirit, the transcendental spirit or the transcendental self. So the second part of this is you have to realize that Brahman alone is real. Or spirit alone, is real; or something before the big bang, that, alone is real. There is an ever-present, spiritual awareness that's unmanifest, it doesn't enter the world of time or stream or torture or suffering or pain. Awakening to that is known as satori or moksha and that's profound re-orientation because it shows you the ever-present reality that doesn't change while all these other exterior states are changing. Then theres the third step which, is even if you're resting as the witness and all of these things are arising, arising, falling, arising, falling... you have equanimity in the face of all this and you are detached from all of this and there's a sort of clear, light, radiant, emptiness that is your fundamental and ever-present condition. The witness still has a sense of standing back and witnessing something out here. So the third stage, which is moving into the non-dual is realizing that subject and object are one -- as we were saying earlier, that Brahman is the world. Now, that emptiness is form; that which is form is not other than emptiness; that which is form is not other than emptiness. So that's the ultimate nondual realization. What Descartes was doing, was an almost the perfect version of Western Vedanta. And he was absolutely brilliant in what he was doing. And what he wanted to do was to get people out of the realm of mere manifestation, or mere samsara. And so he use doubt; he used intense inquiry which is just like Ramanan Harish's inquiry which is "who am I?" or "what is it that I could doubt?" And Descartes started out by saying, "I can doubt objects of the sensory world" because I mean it might be "The Matrix"; it might be virtual reality; it might be illusion.

Video Details

Duration: 8 minutes and 53 seconds
Country: Spain
Language: English
Genre: None
Views: 122
Posted by: ojelwilber on Mar 21, 2009

descartes

Caption and Translate

    Sign In/Register for Dotsub above to caption this video.