TVP Teamspeak Q&A Seminar - 2012-04-08 - Human Behavior and Depression

Hi everyone, thanks from coming. Yes, thank you all for participating. We are going to do a lecture first on human behaviour and depression. It's about forty four minutes and then will take questions along those lines, so thanks again and will get started. Okay. Today we're going to talk about depression. Feeling low, useless, feeling that you can't do anything about some particular problems whether their personal, or social, or you're not included in in participation. What is depression, first of all? Depression is based upon, in most cases, looking for justice, or looking for positive answers. You can't look for positive answers, unless you know what to look for. If an average person tries to build a bridge, a real bridge, they could not participate because they don't know the math, they don't know the formula, they don't understand the problems. The same with depression. When a person feels depressed, and somebody says "why do you feel depressed?", they don't know, they just feel depressed, because they don't have the tools to work themselves out of that. Now I'm going to talk about the tools. If you ask the average person how big the pontoons have to be on a sea plane of a giving size? They don't know, and will run in the loop saying "I don't know." "There's nothing I can do about the sea plane." The same with depression. When you don't have the answers to those problems you go around in loops, you always feel depressed. Now there's verifiable depression such as the loss of a loved one, or a dear friend, or a particular stress, when you're told that you have cancer, and you have a short time to live, they should be a depression, yes, but if you're in good health and you don't feel that life is passing you by, you might become depressed because you feel that you're useless, or with low self-sufficiency, or you don't know what to do about it. So, depression is usually caused by lack of information or tools to overcome the problem. If you can't do anything about it, if there is a earthquake, and your friends are killed, it's normal to feel depressed for a certain period of time, if a depression extends it means you don't have the tools to deal with it. The tools to deal with it is "what you can do to prevent earthquakes, or diminish it?" Convert your depression to some constructive attitude, if you don't know how to do that, look up information on constructive attitude. Constructive attitude is doing something about it, therefore the feeling of depression the feeling that you can't do anything about certain conditions the feeling that you're not useful to yourself or society all of these indicate improper information. All depression is based upon the inability to handle certain problems having no tools to deal with those problems. If you have the tools to deal with the problems, it goes something like this: if a tree falls over and you say: "Gee, that tree is been there for years, that is a shame." Plant a new tree, or straighten up the old tree if that bothers you. If you can't, you've got to accept it as part of natural occurrence. If you are getting ready for a picnic and it's raining or it's cold out you feel like your life has been interfered with, that is your own projection. Whatever happens is real. What you think should happen is what depresses you. So it's your expectations that depress you. I put out a certain amount of effort toward that person, and they left me. That means that you had expectations. So what depresses you is your own limited information, your own sense of projection, your own sense of values. When I say your own sense I mean the values that you pick up in your society. So really, what is missing? The same thing that's missing when people ask you to design safe automobiles. No matter how much you think about it, you don't know enough about it to provide safety devices. You don't know how output proximity devices on cars you don't know anything about it so therefore you go around in loops, "Oh my god, that was a terrible accident, I wish I could have been there, I wish I could do something about it, those words do not solve problems. What solves a problem is: "Do I know enough about the subject to ease out of it?" The answer is no. If an airplane were to have a bad landing and a lot of people are injured, and you're depressed, the next question is could you do anything about it? No, so the depression remains. If you could do something about it make better tires, safer tires for airplanes, that's converting depression to an action pattern. If you just feel depressed, it means you don't have the tools to pull out, that's all it means. So, if a nation goes to war, and you send your sons to war, and you hope he doesn't get killed, that may depress you, but what do you really want is no war, you want conditions that will produce depression, so you've joined an organization to fight those conditions, to alter those conditions. If you do nothing to alter the conditions, nothing will happen. Now, even if you do something to alter the conditions. If there is something that you do is too different than the nature of the culture it will not be adopted. If you go to the army, and say why don't you guys study public health, and how to improve relationship with other nations, the army says "we have." Now they have within their concept, you have to invite the other nations, "what do you consider a constructive compromise?" Not you going in saying "You got to think like we do." You can't solve problems that way. You can't walk into another country, and say "Take down the pope, takedown catholicism, they're not about to do that, that is a request that is unattainable. Now, if you wish to grow food without spraying pesticides on the food, well, there's nothing you can think about, if you don't know that sound can keep certain insects off food; you have to know the answer to various problems. That's the way you solve depression. What depresses you is your expectations, not necessarily the real world. So most people who have become depressed do not have the tools, or the answers to questions. They either feel they're rejected, they liked a certain person, but the person did not return that feeling to them, or you're in love with somebody, but somebody doesn't love you. Well there's a lot of people you don't like, that you reject, but you don't think about that, so you've got to remember that different people have different standards, if they like you, they may have parallel values, if not, they would not like you. It's normal. Now, it's very rare that a nazi family would adopt a jewish baby, because they are certain (?) that interfere with that, and if they did adopt a jewish baby, if it misbehaved in some way, they'd say "it's probably because they're jewish", See that is the only type of rationalization, or if you go out with an afro-american, and somebody says, "well you're going out with a different kind of person, you should go out with your own kind." Sooner or later, everybody will hurt you, in some way or another. So you say, that's that damn african-american, is that damn Filipino, this a damn jew, or it's a damn Italian, everybody does things at times that you don't like, including yourself, you do many things you don't like, but if you do too many things that you don't like, it means that you are on a track that isn't relevant as is your background. You have no way of thinking your way out of it. So that is study of behavioral science, has nothing to do it present day psychology. Behavioral science concerns itself with the factors that shape your behavior. Now, if the behaviour is shaped by toxins, or poisons, that's something else entirely different. If the behavior is shaped by brain damage or physical injury, Where you can't longer walk, and you want to walk or you want to get around. If you don't even have the money for a wheelchair, then you have to work out solutions within the conditions that you're in, either you don't get around with the wheelchair, or you get books or you have somebody get books for you, that you might be interested in or you'd work on activities within your range, Or, if you're living with pain that's so severe, you may want to end your life, that is not unreasonable if you can't get medical care. And a lot of people do. They get in so much trouble in their lives, due to the value system they have which they picked up from their culture, their value system does not offer solutions to their problems, So, life becomes painful and they decide to take their life, because living is too painful. That's because they don't have alternatives to turn to. The more alternatives you have, the lower the probability of depression. So, depression is not a psychological condition manic sometimes they feel high, very high, sometimes they feel very low, What psychology does and psychiatry is invent a label for you; that does not describe the condition. When you call a person a schizophrenic, Are they schizophrenic because people in their neighborhood threaten them? If you live in an Italian neighbourhood, and you're not Italian, the most Italians would boycott you, or that is if they're brought up that way, they won't behave pleasantly toward you so we feel that everybody's against you. They are in your neighborhood. Sometimes it's real. Everybody was against every new idea. The liberation of women, the freedom of the slaves. There was always somebody against it. But if you're a minority and you advocate a program that's not possible within the limits of that society, then you have to accept that society is too far backward to understand that change. Or if you go in with great enthusiasm and great belief, and they still don't understand, you might say "well what's the matter with those people?" Nothing is the matter with those people, they've been indoctrinated for years against Filipinos, or against afro-americans, or against sweeds, or jews, or Pollacks. The society you live in gives you a set of values that somewhat appropriate for the success of some members of that society. It has nothing to do with your own life. So, they program you the fit within that society, but if you really don't fit within that society you may get depressed, because you don't know who you are, or what you are, or what you stand for, or what kind of contributions to make to society, you feel you're a failure. All failures are people that have inappropriate information. Now you'll have to ask questions like: what IS appropriate information? Information essential to the conditions you live under, that will help you out of those conditions. Such as, if you plant a group of flowers, and they freeze, you like flowers, now you're hurt, because you lost the flowers. But there is a possibility of covering those flowers, so they are not subject to the freeze. But if you don't have the tools to do that, you will encounter problem after problem. All problems, except physical diseases which you can get, which can torture you, torment you, that's a reason, that people take their lives, they have no way of that, they don't know how to control that, and if doctors don't know how to control that, the decisions you make are based on what you know, and how much pain you feel. If we could devise a system which is called chemotherapy, chemotherapy is using drugs to make a person feel good, that's not based on the value system. When the drugs wear out, you feel depressed again, so they have to take the drugs. Rather than drugs, what you really need is a process level for understanding what it is that depresses you, and what tools you lack, so you have to seek out the tools, the methods of solving those problems, not taking drugs as an anti-depressant. You can't, you can make a person feel relaxed, but until the chemical is wears out, because there's not change in the values. People that use such systems are really doing inappropriate research, unless you use that system temporarily until the person becomes better informed. Unless psychology alters your values, and points out other ways of living, which are not inherent in your social system. Then you become aberrated to other people. You appear very different, you don't fit in, if you don't know a new way of thinking, or a different way of thinking. Or let's say you are peacemaker, one that that advocates peace in a nation at war, the nation's thinks you are subversive, you're hurting their war effort, and you feel depressed. Only if you know what you're saying is true, you feel sorry for the other people that use force. Instead of feeling depressed, you feel sorry for the people that kill, e.g soldiers, you understand? You only feel depressed when you're not sure of your beliefs, or your acceptance. If you believe you can build a flying machine, and everybody says you're nuts, and you feel depressed about that, it means that you are not sure about your own convictions. If you know you can build a flying machine, you don't depend on what people say. If you believe that all people should have equal rights, and most people don't believe that, you feel sorry for the other people, and you try to change them. And if you can't change them, you say I don't have the ability to change them. Feeling depressed means you expected some change, because you delivered some effort and logic. You can't... You only get it from other people what you get from them, not what you hope to get, do you understand that? So feeling disappointed on people, must be disappointment on your own expectations, not the other people. They are consistent with their background. We are going to talk about behavioral sciences and many different action patterns that people have. But this is the basis that I am giving you without the "Sunny day in May". Those of you that don't know what that means, I wanted to know as a kid how airplanes fly. And I took a book out on the Wright brothers and it opened with "there was a sunny day in May and Mrs. Orville Wright was hanging clothing one the line. I did not want to know that, I wanted to know how airplanes fly. So, the most books you read have a lot of "Sunny day in May" and very little information because writers get paid by the amount of words they put out so you got to think about that. And sometimes people don't have information they say if only the people would be kind and considerate and learn to live in peace and harmony with one another we wouldn't have war. Well, how do we do that? That's the problem. What you think, sometimes, is the words that you hear, "if only people become considerate, kinder, deeper understanding." Without elaboration, nobody knows what you're talking about. So people agree with the conclusions, we're going to be kinder, understanding, but nobody knows what understanding means. If you don't understand yourself, you can't understand other people. Understand means accept the things you cannot change, know where to look to promote change, and some people that are ready for it. There are many people that will not change, that cannot change, due to do their heavy indoctrination. So you've got to understand, when you meet with people, you give the best that you can, to help them understand. If they fail, it may mean that your delivery was not relevant to their values, or that they had been too heavily indoctrinated to accept what you say. You don't know that, so you don't come at it with "I'm sure, I feel, I can get you to understand me." You can't be that sure, unless you know anything about them, and very few people know everything about anybody else. People will revert back to their way of thinking, because they have no other tools. When you come at them, you're giving them new tools, which they may not fully understand. If they fully understand what you're talking about, they will begin to practice, saying, "I don't know.. but I'm going to try," when you try, and it doesn't work, you become discouraged. Remember, whenever you try anything, (be it) art, painting, sculpture, if it doesn't work, you become discouraged rather than knowing that the instructor was unable to get the information to you, or you don't have enough background to make that leap, or that you don't have enough understanding to move in that direction. Even though you wish to become a flyer, and you get an airplane, and you can't keep the airplane straight, and a pilot will say "You will never be a flyer, you have no good sense of balance." He is not imparting information to you, he is imparting the results of your inability to fly. But information is checking with the horizon line, and closing your eyes and to tell the person when the chair is tilted to the left and right, practice! Then you can pretty much say, "I feel too much pressure in the right part of the buttocks, or in the left part of the buttocks" that is what the guy does that knows how to fly. He may not know how to transfer that to you, he says "You just don't make a good pilot, you don't have the ability." Those are 'no information words' it's a feeling you get when the planes flying at an angle, you feel different pressures, you don't pay attention to those, you pay attention "I can't keep this airplane straight." People don't know how to transfer information. Now, even if you're not sensitive to that, you can be put in a dummy cockpit, and tilted, and learn to say "I think I'm merely upright, because the pressure is even on the right and left side of my body, on the chair." You can be made aware of thing if you're not aware of, assuming the person doesn't have paralysis of the nervous system. Of course because you use your eyes, but you also use other systems, if you blindfold a person and have them walk on crooked surface they have problems. If I took two prisms and put them in front of your eyes and rock them uniformly with a rhythm you would wobble up and back, if I tilt the horizon you would go to the left then you go to the right. If I put binocular vision on a puppy with a periscope, so the sight level is 2 inches of the ground a little dog looks like a big dog, and the dog will appropriately respond to that. If you make a distance look four times as deep as it is, and the animal will stop at steps rather tend to go down. The brain is associated already with a certain perspective. If you produce that same thing in an optical device, a person will behave just as though they're twenty feet high, even though there're only three feet off the ground. They have to react to that, that's based on experience and associated memory. If you fill a person's brain, and you tell him that the Greeks are responsible to all the world problems today, if you do that over and over again, that's what the propaganda is: repeat of the same thing over and over again, your ability to discriminate between propaganda and reality, you have no training in it in school, your trained in patriotism, you're not trained in different people have different points of view, due to the difference of upbringing. Now if you train people in that way, you can't control them, that's why we trained a certain way. Because we live in a civilization, although I use the word 'civilization', we are not civilized yet. Being civilized is knowing where to look, what to accept, what to reject as highly improbable, and somebody says "Jesus is coming tomorrow morning," That's highly improbable, because people talk about the end of the world coming, years and years back it had never came, says I've got the wrong dates, the Moon is not the right place. You can invent all kinds of things. You have to learn how to say: "What I heard seems to me highly improbable." It may be probable, but if you don't have the tools to evaluate it... If a surgeon talks to a lay person about new techniques in surgery, they can't always understand that, because they don't have the background that that person has, or the doctor hasn't talk to you. If you talk about new inventions into electronics, and the person has no experience in the field at all, you make assumptions, first thing you do is you say: "Do you know anything about electronics? Do you know what a resistor is? You know what a transformer is? -No." And you have to tell them that, then you can go into things. Some people even though you deliver genuine information, if they don't have the background to assimilate, you're talking to yourself. Or sometimes you might talk to people about human behavior, for a little while, then you say them "Are you interested into that subject?" They said "Not particularly", then get off. But if you come up to people and say "Are you familiar with the The Venus Project? - No. - Are you interested in social change, are you interested in a world without war? - Not particularly, I'm interested in me." So, that means don't bother, they're not interested. If they enquire into things, you tell them a little bit and say what you think I mean, and they come up with something entirely different and repeat in another way, until you get the same meaning, because all people will react, not to you, to their background, so whenever you get disappointed on another person, it's never the other person, it's your expectations that are wrong. If you want to use words, like 'right' & 'wrong', which I don't ordinarily use. You don't allow for differences in background; you figure I told the person, therefore they should understand; they don't understand, it means you didn't tell them anything. Or sometimes you do tell them things, but the ego trip gets in the way. Now I want to tell you something, you spoke your words, now I'll speak mine. 'Sharing', you know, a lot of people believe in equal participation, although they may not have qualification for equal participation or they don't understand your use of language. And I don't say that psychologists and psychiatrists don't arrive at some truths, some actual things, they do, but they don't have a clear picture of what it is that shapes behaviour, they say, "When life hits you like that you hit it back, you take hold of yourself" Did you ever hear that? "Use your head, think!" You can't if the guy says "My landing gear won't come down", ask the psychiatrist, "What does he suggest you do?" to make the landing gear come down? (instead)he says "I don't know anything about airplanes", well you don't know anything about behaviour either if you just say "When life hits you like that, you hit it back!" That sounds good, makes you feel confident but it doesn't work. You can't hit life back. You can understand it, or you can understand where on a person is coming from but Psychiatry is "Why do you hate your mother?" or "You have a compulsion neurosis." What's that? What's a 'compulsion neurosis'? There's no such thing as a 'compulsion neurosis'. Or the person is inattentive, it means that what you have to say doesn't get to them at all so they wonder while you're talking. But if he says "How would you like a bag of candy?" Most kids would be very attentive. (?) "Or would you like an ice cream cone? - Yes" "Would you like to spend the day in prison?" Well, that's not interesting so inattentive people are usually not attentive in your subject or they're brought up not to be interested in your subject. or they have a value system that clashes with their outlook. So all of us are inattentive. If you took an intelligent person, a doctor, and you begin to talk about how pickles are determined ripe in the pickle factory they may not be interested in that so they pay less attention to it. If you say that there are three new great developments in Medicine they lean forward, because they're doctors but if they're shoe makers they don't lean forward. But if you say "There's a new way to put shoes together faster and a new glue that holds leather together!" they may lean forward. So everybody is inattentive to some subjects, otherwise everybody would be a generalist. Do you understand? but if you say "The trouble with you is that you're inattentive" that does not inform anybody about anything, it informs them about your rejection of their behaviour and without giving them anything you leave them in midair. Or "The trouble with you my wife is you don't always cook the things I like." Well apparently you haven't made it clear or she doesn't give a damn. and that's something for you to decide. So everybody is inattentive to certain subjects. If I give you a big fat book on women's garments there's not a thing in there that a certain person would read, if he's a bricklayer, he doesn't give a damn about those things, so the trouble with him is that he is inattentive. Everybody is inattentive to some area. You go to the gun club and talk about hydrodynamics, (the pumping of fluids) they would fall asleep. Talk about guns they all wake up, because they have mono interest or limited interest and then you say "The trouble with you is you're not interested in hydrodynamics." Well that doesn't make them interested in hydrodynamics. People only become interested in something that is relevant to their value system. So you talk to twenty people and nothing happened, "Bunch of dummies!" No they're not. They're hooked in a certain value system and your expectations do not fit that circumstance. So, when I say we talk at people when people come here I try and find out where they're coming from if they're the women's club and fashion club, I might talk to them about Veblen's work in fashion and how it got to be, then they would question their field. Do you understand? If you teach people even if they're into fashion, you can alter them by starting with fashion, and if they are architects you start out with "What is a shelter?" "Well, a shelter is a home that people live in." Well, a shelter is a space suit out in space. That's a shelter. Within it is an atmosphere, you can defecate, you wear diapers in the space suit, you can urinate because there's something to catch the urine. So that's a shelter. What is a shelter when you go underwater you wear a diving suit? You bring with you your environment under the water because you can't live underwater. So when we have is a fixed definition of a shelter, it's a house with a pointy roof. all our notions about anything about anything is part of indoctrination. So when you say "yes, but what about thinking for yourself? You can't do that unless you lived in other cultures have read different kinds of books have been exposed to sociology anthropology and understand that different people have different reactions to the same thing. "The trouble with you is that you're inattentive." That doesn't work. Ask them if they're interested in what you're talking about. Apparently your mother is not interested in what you talk about. And she can't even hear it, she looks at you as a strange boy interested in things that don't count. What really counts? That's very difficult to ask a person whether they're into semantics, of course they're not, they would come up with those questions. That's why a lot of people say "It seems to me" which is better. "It seems to me that we are moving in the wrong direction." It doesn't mean that it's moving in a wrong... "It seems to me" is good or "I believe that", that's alright. I believe that the person misbehaves but I don't know why. Rarely do people speak like that. They don't speak like that, they never terms like "It seems to me" or I feel it's highly probable. They don't speak that way, so you know who you're dealing with without asking them whether they ever heard of semantics. I'm sure if you even talk to a semanticist they have words like "either or". You never say "either/or" but if you're on a precipice and you take one step backwards it's either/or. There are either/or conditions. So when a semanticist tries to codify language and fit it in their field, they sometimes negate it. Or they would say "How do you feel about this construct?" that's pretty good, you're inviting other people "Oh.. you'll never see that due to human nature." Well, what is your meaning when you use the term human nature? Inborn patterns of human behaviour. Like what? You say "Patriotism, is that inborn?" Well not that. they might understand that. so you have to show them, it's up to you to take their value system and dissect it and show them that is not as useful as "What have we here? I don't know, let's check it out." That's a useful observation. The man is evil. There was a man, this is a true story I'm telling you: this guy used to get up every morning and the neighbor walked down the street he used to say "Good morning" and the neighbor never answered to him, and he was a little disappointed. Years later he found out that he was deaf, he never heard anything the guy said, this is true, sometimes a person has a normal set of the face is a frown, and you say "Old sourpuss!" Do you understand me? That's a normal posture. "That old sourpuss!" And everybody agrees. And the guy himself thinks he's an old sourpuss. People project like mad. Now there's a difference between extrapolating and projecting when you extrapolate, if you notice in cold weather some trees begin to wither and if it gets cold you can extrapolate that's going to wither more. but projection is assuming things without any basis for that assumption, except everyone has a right to their own opinion. That's not extrapolation that's a repeat of a slogan. So our society is so wrapped up in irrelevancy and that is a difficult problem. The more irrelevant (?)to society the more you have to work to convert them to another system. If that system does not appear useful to them and will not hear it. So you have to package it so it appears useful to them. How would you like to get along with people and not get into fights? The guy Paul that used to work here, he used to... when somebody would insult him or hurt him he would provoke a fight. Now he sits. He understands that if he fights he could wind up in jail, he can injure the other person, the other person can injure him, he can been killed, so he doesn't fight anymore any more. He says "What used to make me angry and fight doesn't anymore." Getting into a physical fight the guy insults you: "You're nothing but a pinhead." You say: "What do you say about me?" You know I was in a restaurant once eating and a big guy came at me and said, "You're sitting in my chair." So I got up and let him have it. He was the kind of guy that would use force, so I said "That's right." He would be called a bully in other... "You let that guy move you out of your chair? Well, I would tell him off." Well you feel good telling him off but you got a black eye, two teeth missing, and brain injury. But you told him off. So what? And they say "Boy, you're chicken, you're meek you don't stand up for what you believe in." And that encourages soldiers: "Standup for what you believe in get out there and fight!" So they send you home in a plastic bag in pieces, but you stood up for your beliefs. Nobody gives a shit about that. I'm saying in a nutshell that the world doesn't hurt people unless there's an earthquake. But most people are hurt by their expectations of others and the world. The world itself operates a certain way. When there's an earthquake you maintain stability, get out of the building so it doesn't fall on you or you get into a shelter that seems to be strong; that's more appropriate than saying "What the hell is the matter with nature?" or "God will take care of me". Some guy fell off a tree with a chainsaw and it only cut part of him. He said Jesus protected me I could have lost my arm. You can project your own values. Jesus has nothing better to do than to watch billions of people at the same time and to protect you. Really simplistic values. they are shockingly painful and dangerous (?)Due to simplistic values a person may want to kill you, because you say you don't believe in Muhammad and therefore you don't believe in Allah and Allah made everything on Earth, you are evil. And if a person really believes that he will treat you like somebody who hurts him. And you are hurting him. So, all these different things have to be taken into account. We can't anticipate the background of other people. There's nothing wrong in asking him: "what's are your favorite books? whom do you admire, the pope?" whoever they admire gives you some tools to work with but if you just come at people you're projecting the assumption that the person appears to be full grown therefore they would understand. People know nothing until you do a survey of "What have we here? The answer: "I don't know." Then the survey. What are your favorite books? What kind of movies do you like? If you do that first it's much easier than just coming at them. And you can't talk to people that say: I regret that I only have but two sons to give to my country, they both have died in action and I am a war hero from WW1. That person is not asking you what do you think of a enemy nation? What is an enemy? He's not that person he's a person that you would say "Boy, I sure admire you for giving your two sons to the country. That's what he wants to hear, that's part of the grammar of motives. You can't talk to certain people because they aren't there to talk they are there to have their rigid opinions verified And you have a hell of a lot of people. So you go to the American Legion meeting and talk about world unification you stand much less of a chance than talking to the humanists. People don't think about that they feel so sure of their own views that other people will understand them, "You guys are nuts!" and they walk out. Very difficult job unless they come to hear you. Unless you identify with them especially if you get up and say, start off with "I'm Jewish" which is much easier. - You know what I mean? - Yes, we didn't mentioned that kind of thing, identifying with them first. Yes, if you don't identify with them... I'm a member of the boy scouts of America that's okay too. Or I am a Greek whoever you talk to; when I went to Greece I sang a Greek song. And they all applauded. (R Meadows) -They loved it, he opened by singing(?) Oh they went crazy! Will cut back now. We can go into some questions. "Can technological unemployment in and of itself collapse the system?" -Yes Are there efforts involved in research and development of a technical plan out that addresses the practicality of a Resource Based Economy (?)may be something that addresses are current state and how to proceed? (J Fresco) -I don't think so unless you study something about energy determinants how much energy it takes to accomplish a given task. We can only compare things to the energy they required to accomplish a given task. "If not any ideas on how to get this effort started?" (R Meadows) -Are you talking about technical blueprints for a Resource Based Economy? I'm not sure what they're talking about. "Are there any technical blueprints for a Resource Based Economy being developed?" - Yes. "Jacque why don't you write any material for mainstream, for example, a book on depression, tips, techniques, information and advice?" (J Fresco) -I can't do that because I don't have any credentials and the book would not be widely accepted it's like talking about Christianity in a Muslim country. The Muslim people already have a set regarding their beliefs. It's very difficult unless they come to you and say what is Christianity, what is an atheist? What is an agnostic? Not "WHAT IS AN AGNOSTIC!?" Not in anger. If they ask questions, yes, you can answer them. "I'm concerned about the the separation between the Zeitgeist Movement and The Venus Project in regards to finding common ground between even those who agree with the ideals of a Resource Based Economy. Do you believe that this creates the conditions needed to create a Resource Based Economy?" (R Meadows) -Anybody who wants to work with a Resource Based Economy, with The Venus Project, the doors are open. I don't think that we're going to be joining The Zeitgeist Movement to do anything in regards to what they're working with. We're working a bit in different directions. We don't have hostility to the members of The Zeitgeist Movement I'm not sure what else to say about that. Do you want to say anything about that? - Yes, The Zeitgeist Movement does not have a blueprint for any aspects of attaining a Resource Based Economy. They are people who point out the shortcomings of our present culture and let different people come in and make suggestions as to which way to go. I don't understand that I would understand it if they had a procedural system for attaining a Resource Based Economy, but it has to be based on a system that's already been worked out. You can't just sit back and say "Let's do this or let's do that". We could not work with the Zeitgeist Movement because they merely pointed out the shortcomings of our culture and had nothing to do with how to attain a Resource Based Economy I did say that if you wish to know more about it read up read our books, look at our tapes, look at our website so you pick up more information as to how it operates. Without that there is just no communication. "In one of your videos you said potatoes give propensity towards alcoholism what do you mean by that and can you point a research on that?" -No, I can't remember but I read that on a journal on health. And I read that the Irish people that tend to drink more alcohol was due to the heavy diet of potatoes. I never went into it I never looked at the details, I just remember that. (R Meadows) -I am not sure about this question but "How do you condition people when talking to them?" Do you question them back. -Yes, to see if they understand what you mean give them a chance to counteract your statements, and then if you have a procedural system, you use the best knowledge that you have to address the problems you face, but the best knowledge can only be attained if you check on most experiments that have proven certain things. Of course, you have to know what the shortcomings are of experiments. Not all experiments arrive at the same conclusions. Your ability to decipher that which is more relevant or less relevant has to do with your background. "Are you familiar with the movie 'The Secret?' It tells of the energy space It tells of the energy space our thoughts are material and connected with the cosmos. What do you think about it?" (R Meadows) -I remember that too a little bit about 'The Secret?', they talked about that if you manifest what you want in your thoughts it will come about if I remember that correctly (J Fresco) -I have no identification with that film. There's nothing in it that that made sense to me. "What type of food, diet do you eat or do you have to recommend? What is the most optimal diet?" (J Fresco) -I would answer that by saying organically grown food would probably be the most efficient for the human body and would eliminate great many problems because to grow a cow or an animal takes a lot of food, and you can feed more people if you don't use... if you use a vegetarian organically grown food you stand less of a chance of contracting disease; if the food has artificial coloring or is genetically altered, we don't know enough about it, there's not enough time that have been devoted to research in that area. So I would stay away from genetically altered food and chemically treated food, and artificial coloring and flavoring. These are the conclusions I arrive at. It doesn't make it correct I'm just telling you what I accept in that area. There's a lot of work to do in that area, to arrive at more appropriate decisions. -We have a question about prohibited herbs and stuff like that. How do you plan to handle stuff like alcohol, cigarettes and prohibited drugs? -They won't be available. - In a Resource Based Economy? - In a Resource Based Economy detrimental things would not be available, you couldn't buy hotdogs or cigarettes, they will not be made. And people who are addicted to that would be treated with the best knowledge we have for treating such addiction. I'm just trying to help people understand why they act the way they do. Instead of getting angry at a person, I look at them differently, I say "They don't have the tools to understand or I'm using tools that do not register with them. In other words if I go to a Klu klux klan meeting I can't come out with my values; they wouldn't understand it so I have to alter my values and give really primitive examples and if they begin to understand then you can become more elaborate with the passing of time. The degree of information that you present depends on how much they've learned. -I guess we'll wrap it up for today, then. -Yes, thank you for all your efforts that you put out, and thanks for the opportunity to be able to answer some of your questions. -Yes, we really appreciate everybody's work towards the film that just came out to the new documentary, how they're helping spreading it around, and everything else that you're doing. - It's a real pleasure working with everyone. - Yes, I agree with that. -Trying to change the world is a pleasure. -It's a great adventure. -Thank you that was very helpful. -Hopefully we'll see you next week.