Ben McLeish talks TZM for the coming documentary 'Perspectives on Contemporary Britain'
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My name is Ben McLeish. And, well there's two things I do really
In my sort of day time life
I work in the technology- and information-industry,
in the library wells, specifically.
And what I do in my spare-time is to operate in a distributed,
global movement called 'The Zeitgeist Movement' -
broadly speaking seeks to change
the sort of fundamental value system that our global culture is based on
from one of sort of over-consumption and unsustainability
to one of actual sustainability and of technological progress.
So I run those two side by side. remains a second again
and imagined one would pay me not to do the other
this movement is essentially social movement it's not it's easier to
uh... it's not a political movement you recognize politics has
option
uh... in addressing the issues that we talk about
uh... it's volunteering social a grass roots and from goods
centers on actual sustainability
we
seek a reorientation of to major elements of society one that is a very
very simple ones when stand
we need a society that functions on physical level that actually has
advanced intelligent automated to the to the most agree the karen systems
enable efficient transport efficient energy usage efficient land usage
that part of our understandings are that we need to sustainable city systems very
uh... in venus project called by buckminster fuller like many other
futuristic city planners
so that's the sort of the first level is
we understand that
think we think about waiving winding type it in fact one thing this is the
and we need to live on its me to continue for the moment and as well as
possible
and we understand also that it divided society whether or not poor people
people suffering to become nor'easter educated am isn't really a functioning
society its wartime will actually negatively impact those people who are
you can see from uh... works by people like uh... which wilkinson
and uh... take pictures from university
in that comparison of
the ratio of difference between the top ten percent and the bottom ten percent
of
people in society according to that read as well
the most divided societies in that sense
uh... are the ones with the most stressed about the highest rates of
motor incarceration incarceration length
under of prisoners number of prisons obesity levels
and even thing like innovation levels correction
in more equal society's fun you know if it's not absolutely
in societies where the course are not as poor as another cited within walking
toward the ratio to them
do worse than the ones that are said even if the lowest ten percent
orion
but absolute does not fit correlates
we understand that the the basic values
uh... as associations of our society
aunt indian transition as well
human beings
actually require certain things
uh... we require foods required closing we need someone stay we need if you like
around tonya have we'd need clean out to brief you need
clean water to trade
soon really any makes sense to release
start redesigning a new system based on those things
and then we can build out and see what other wonderful things we can get which
and cell
we proposal i specifically propose resource based economy an economy where
we first understand in order to have function in society and that is a global
we are one human rights will
brothers and sisters in a very literal genetic sense
uh...
we need to do point technology to absolutely says
man evident
the monthly systems comes when it was very useful for awhile have not been
income people ranking and antimony
uh... and still understand history chains
that we've all this economy and other because now it isn't
serving us anymore and that was the goal to begin interested insure that there
was enough labor said there are enough resources
so that we have the system so that people are k
and now that we have technology that can really wants to make great on of what we
do
and really do it and great deal that used to require money that doesn't and
now that money is obviously being abused in this sort of debt for more deaths
consequences on the environment and on hold people's
evidently there's no one we have to move to london sustains life
so with those basic understandings we seek at transition house calls
the soul of mishmash accidentally interconnected system we have now
into a global unified what we call resource based system
i wonder why i think it is a case movement
for the way that we really differ is that i have not yet release
of all sides because we have more than a half million members goes read really
right back to the recalls
often people say expertise aren't even greedy men to change and soviet
influence law schools analyst
or in the case of presumptive electric a greenpeace is incredibly important work
they still around the nation's they still don't see i think to this to the
merits of the same degree readings
that in fact
the session economic system its fundamental level is the problem
and if you really have to provide
and i also don't seem really anybody talking about if only global level
uh... the understanding that in fact released patchwork things that we pick
petition for this for fall
which all problems are all in fact
at some level have been greatest them
happened a common
indeed
increasing
socio-economic stressed about time so that's what i would say
on organizational level is another word we don't have stomachs
leadership structure doesn't really exist high for example and fairly
prominent icebergs in the movement but i wasn't elected
uh... and reports when it's so i don't get told what to say or do i and pipes
me category
on a very good level of investment said
structure the moon is actually very much like the internet
in that it is a distributed
collective that have chapters which you have
location based chocolate and have a four freezer and we have effects where people
come together
but these are all within a framework an individual
global
i'm content they said we have have three hundred four hundred
parallel events around the world in different time zones
and haven't seen that kind of special interest and for
up one side really addressing
going right back addressing the root causes
of the century problem understanding amongst understanding how politics must
understanding how the environment works in the sense of how it affects us
and on the other side the way that we choose to communicate that information
halloween inform each other and keep up-to-date with each other i think we're
we are sinking pretty much as quickly as everybody else into the steps spiral
image is exacerbated by
more bailouts and from two thousand eight so now it's become very very clear
a lot of people that when we talk about bailing out
it isn't actually bailing out what's happening is that money family is being
so that the selected from social life system so if that's
healthcare which is
pretty much can be privatized in the next few years rhetoric kathleen slowly
uh... or if that pensions which i've devaluing as
more that he's created which means more inflation which means the
uh... or there's no way for me to get an education anymore
uh... and just extend that went down the shore level
recently we've
hey exponentially more than exponential increase in the cost of for example
people who graduated this you have twenty five grand theft and people who
so you're saying
the inability to be educated now on the basic fiscal level and there's
definitely going inherit huge meant that
and i also see that's there's a gradual shift
away from thinking that we're in highlands
so that the kind of ireland mentality and what we're limited when not your
the world
greases bailout what effect does in some way i think this gradually move by
uh... when we talk about british
society british economy
uh... we're actually having a factory and the world
states whether that's
the world economy in terms of ministry economics or whether it's the state of
whether it's an interesting stockton x
spend hours
the really excel eration may have begun with delivers thatcherite dogma for
example back that not all of the government's and behavior towards life
systems towards
in in these kinds of things was the height of privatization time some good
things that happened during that time
and a lot of the values of response by that was very much
you know you get to signal that's selfish and
in again and hyperbole mission
where it's going to get comfort in a little bit more tricky
way that i thought she was born salt basically i was born in and print
corporate has very very quickly
and
then i think deceleration towards not being able to work out what was going on
and what the direction of the government action was
operating under a severe called old man
for political rhetoric if you like
sportster seen the opposite of what it was doing more citizen in the delivery
capitalization thanks
thatcherite reaganite years i think what's happened now after days to graze
segments writing
physically extremely small ministry
and is that the social systems now breaking down in offices when when
people realizing that's
it doesn't matter who i vote for
someone to be done
no control over afterwards he changes their mind who breaks that promise
and that in fact
that is almost entirely separate that whole process completely separate to
and what the nation declines or indeed the world requires inuit song operates
as a purposes sightseeing and now that we're seeing the abrasion pensions
actually have in fact on the people who are now retiring this kind of gradual
tendency towards proper break down whether it's access to education health
camel clean water these kinds of things that you see
gargi cd findings
it's
some of the people who or to be paying taxes so that cuts cuts also that spent
a lot of friends at live outside and one thing that school was pointed out is
commonly one tabloid press
no it's not all that
things on the b_b_c_ things at the garden independent a pretty good
newspapers all of the b_b_c_
the rear and things like greg palace um... uncovering of need two thousand
action be installed they were without when for example mackney however it is
showing the overall effects of the holy
is quite uh... sort of infotainment
degenerates simplification country
it's crime nikon believes anything
it's very simple
we also have an astonishing tendency towards celebrity
really rival in this
celebrity vacation
this education
what isn't even people who are papers
just reality tv stuff
they are ordinary people as that would mean is this being sold as-is extra
so i see that taking over next week rounding out a lot of what the media
get to the basis of what is unusual what is needed commodity
what he's actually factions
so i can see a sort of uh... uh... emerging of the entertainment industry
and the newspapers
but i don't know serious right now very positive things
not low-fat i still think the bbc
you know it's not perfect has some astonishing
journalistic people like uh... jeremy taxman newsnight note this e questions
cost that forcefully or indeed that many times in a rather speculate a how much
more you know that uh... annoyances speculate that more than speculate tell
cellulite the
uh... bodies get what they say and i think i think when you look act almost
busters about websites i don't know if i know that uh... what everyone says how
season it will of figure less offender the calls of them they are just that
white cops
it is interesting
if you keep carrots some of what we consider to be the real leading
i think it has some of the school
you can see that as strange basket journalists just like anybody else pop
microphones victims culture
they all informed by the same zeitgeist
as everybody house and said the general biases that off sort of
and apart
whichever newspaper you're writing
dancing to persist within very steve
he was actually questioning the fractional reserve landing system yet
so that might be the first limit to why there is a sort of uh... a quite narrow
themselves it might be pre
programming of that particular mindset warranty the filter
and on the other side it's it strange as well
uh... bills
the debate never really gets down to the calls i don't see them
and afognak points back
weekend even lines
beyond a very short time future
but is a very concrete example of somebody is a very good job listing is
well rather than does some very good argument so george moldy
uh... went to france in kanata quite surprising to see how friendly
uh... now you have slightly different reasons and others
any human being who is really looking at the basic effects of nuclear
accidents whether they have one studio where they have monson fifties
would understand that that kind of long-term damage must be avoided or
at least in fact there is basically the same the media on one side are in fact
mostly
hateful uphold the status quo and the status quo right
is nuclear there are huge best-dressed the energy industry generally
is hugely vested in eastern isn't
spend that's partly economics and it's also partly
at the fact that you are staffed ninja companies
you are in that system and that featured a million educates the people
and of course the people that stood out what they think papers uh... and what
they believe is accurate that did this seems to be either of programming or
the waves it does come after me even the most liberal
and most understanding and they say she achieved people like mom's as well
victims at them
i think that they are limited very much like a prisoner's identified the
is not a bad prison if not taken eight mile walk everyday confident
that environment the physical constraints of you've being prison bean
actions
have their limitations
to very good
slots in society
as open his eyes and i care about this being published this elephants in the
in the meantime it's all available again on the website along with our editors
so we become the b_b_c_'s burst of animals to the family estates
file and starts week with their requests and this one goes out to the following
christians and jews system thing really
when you finish smashing up the world and blood leaks are subject to the money
dispositive have all plan
phantom and obviously we're
in an extremely religious world
i think it's the same in every country some countries are more secular in terms
of its own
dominance discourse
that's and what i see it moments really is the while many religions espouse
wonderful virtues
ideals uh... the real life being employees
by people against people is clinton's
uh... econ offering is a human being
in the world in my view correctly if you believe that ninety percent of the best
and and said
that's the sort of the fact that i see
that's quite different to the
central values that uh... despised by many
religions especially if you compare the eastern religions of the western
there's some wonderful philosophical points family means the human
that calf for others and want you know the golden rule all of the stuff is
when it comes to actually operates construction
being human system
what does it actually do what his relationship you apart from maybe foster
uh... a sort of a vague sense of hope
or meaning about
your life because you weren't just creative as it was assertive by accident
high-powered many religious friends i have a uh... seven religious family they
and his people high myself
i'm a former christian when i really drill them for white is
uh... that they believe what they did
i really
spend
allen's getting down to the nuts and bolts and why
in the face of the evidence that we have contradicted huge damage stacks
heat always comes down to well
i don't want to feel that it's a random world
uh... and yet because that somehow fosters a feeling
a lack of control
i see that lots of sort of religious
beliefs uh... aboard the beneath the comfort it operates with individual
level aldrich into foster this kind of sense of well-being and the sense of
wonder at the pics of the world that we can explain that's usually lumped in
but in the way that it's employed on a social level i think it's very much used
strong sense of belonging religion
and that color lessons
uh... a large number of people
into me group you know whether that's a
a particular church a particular denomination whether it's a particular
it's to appeal to the masses to lie to galvanize votes which is done very much
and in germany still is that you know that's a deal with the within the
still call themselves a christian
uh... even if they may be operation without christian values in the real
institutions to sort of galvanized and control basically on one level despite
the wonderful value has been as center
i think really the the transition in practical terms to a new model that
doesn't use uh... economics away is now
is going to be through a combination of social pressures it'll be increasing
in terms of how the entrance exam when it does for them
being a nation that's quite small they are very small nation wallace and sixty
mines
and was surrounded by
we relied very heavily on high-tech intensive agriculture or
indeed and imports and exports mostly imports really in terms of our fears
and i do think that we're gonna see in some sense the poisoning of our food is
an issue and on the other side the price of the food is gonna keep going up
and on the flip side the
realize a c_ we are very very much dependent upon
uh... the land mass that isn't part of our country for the imports about food
and of course changes in buying sounds like an amine
that uh... company starts suffering
as well now that's going to be prolonged because
the whole goal of things like supermarkets and hyper markets is to
state sheet that you and i like the competition
so that will go on longer has people become
more cost conscious about what the combined
uh... is that i think that's right now but it's going to happen anyway food
more generally environmental collapses the stock really registering on people
uh... you will serve to create a timesheet will depend the natural you
how the machines to create because
and this is going to be a a sort of uh... increase collapse as we start
life that you'll start seeing mister
and that's when you gonna stop seeing and people start going off the grid so
you're gonna see us anything cheaper than a little as will becomes more
yoga also had the same time see through the same technological innovations that
solar an even local wings farming
at become
efficient enough in terms of its cost too
uh... to harvesting abilities gets so cheap
that the society will just simply select through
first of all needs and price
one with a clean system over the other
and then you can see some very interesting things happen
you don't have
uh... a reliance on abortive companies
to incredible polluters
and he really heartening people forget oil and coal and all that
is running out of the stove a group of companies that can see there
and three monopolize the market and handset that pricing they do debbie
harry connick would attack in the community
so i think it's going to be done right now its time
increased prevention people really gets feeling the social pressures
thus the psyche isn't functioning for them anymore answer could do it must be
one on the technology ficient
beating health are present technologies
in new york face to be a huge problem uh... with uh... whole species this was
a huge problem and elections will want and lost on what would be done about the
whole chip problem
and
was so serious that if you're looking asked on the new york architecture
they'll have steps to go out
uh... that some of that but that brings up from the ground that's because of all
the dancing bilby architecture and the problem and change that
because the motor vehicles and that the problem
and i didn't take politics in fact no politician
sold
so in there that is a common example it did get sold by the recipient
futura issues are going to be sold almost accidentally through online
court
to actually sell society's problems
if you really look at fourteen points and what they're doing and and what the
the disgraceful way they've behaved in parliament
yelling at each other obtain brain like some kind of man that crap
speaker recently
schoolchildren exceedingly feet
now if we replace every politician with actual technicians
with people who are really dedicated like old teams and think tanks about how
to solve specific issues
that yes you could use politics
but as i see it wandering into a period and taking the name of a man you do not
unit four years is really opting out of doing something
it's the opposite giving some it's opposite being involved in your society
advocates put there obviously and i find astonishing means
and is prepared to make you feel like you're in control like you have the same
all of our political parties are bound to the same economic goals approved by
and funds as a background background funds
look at the uh... barackobama race this gentleman you social media in an
extremely powerful a
to sort of hardness microfiche it's you one you'll ability to run for president
or prime minister
it is your wealth that puts you jobs not your ability to solve problems
that could be somebody who could deliver you run on that platform boats
lacking the money that you do
and therefore of course being beholden to those uh... private money possesses
who have fun with you
means the economy to see the dull that you actually want to do you have to
pursue bacall of phoenix was money possesses that from the g
i'm sure that over the people in a lot of the christians alumni relations over
the river as well as you cases not stupid people but they all the
they also not that to do what you think that fading off a priori
and completely selected for setting a compromise
say hi to think it's going to be a mixture of grabs a realization of people
that's the socio-political system does not operate the way they think it
doesn't like that
this is somehow found me
and on the other side is going to be m
with problems being
solved in the process to technology people start realizing the technology is
in fact time
they'll realize that the the problems that they see the really big problems
i think it'll go away
so what we do about uh... what can we do have a please
uh... list strengths was collapsing with information from some activity from
point wallets
and getting out of the system century defined by the way they did subtraction
uh... into having to uh... operates with
there are many ways that we can do this i think the most
pressing up is innocent
joining all movements join any movement that understands what the record
and we do need amass i hate to say awakening
from sort of
fogged in
of what is being pushed it does is important
uh... into really reevaluation insane hang on
wouldn't it be better to do this
produce medium right things
read into this information reception start learning about your actual central
i was like twelve you know i don't have that for my party or terrible things
at all the cuts that will happen because of the tories forty it's completely
the logic of monetary system it happened anyway
doesn't matter who it happens to be
the republic of the local other things that i've come to see a very important
delivering on four t_v_ diesel c_d_'s and one five nine eight forty nine why
even better can even buy the materials there's so many free podcasts and set me
that is talking about information is most likely they don't stand
but the monetary paradigm is a problem that's why this stuff is free and this
normal corporate media that is complete the holding very much like politics is
the pages
in the outbreaks of various products
so that's one of the things as well as change applying so i'm not by from
you know mass-produced poisonous supermarket where trying by local
also very simple get out of cash and now it's really hard
first-time it's worth really concentrating on getting rid of credit
staying on the the black side of the of the spectrum when it comes to
backgrounds third expose yourself appetizing
to raise your children with the sense that advertising very much did to that
creating adoption a certain point habits
there's a reason why mcdonnell's has wonderful players
and ninety eleven and and read science and unity happy meals for children there
is a reason for that
is talking to child market doesn't know how to fend for itself
and doesn't suspect
andy chance of wrongdoing or malpractice within the advertising and and promoting
commerce
arena but it's very
you know create your own compost growth and stability or go on
on another level collapse of social events in your community
if and when we do
start moving through real difficult times when there are again contracts and
water shortages
unita general sense of community spirit and to work together
and not fifteen minutes free-for-all
at night
so a lot of people think well him
take-it-or-leave-it another development abides information time in
but we do need to realize if you bring uh...
they are contingents possible
we tossed singular organisms we called ones
people still talk about
different races appears as if they achieve we are human rights this one
uh... the have a common future as well as a common heritage
we have
we have this loss we all on this tiny planet in huge unforgiving uh... space
huge unforgiven taxes
we do need to preserve human life we have to get involved intentions
we have to make sure
that people
uh... surface and not
outlooks often that we are ok all of this information
doesn't just pertains awards
unmask uh... logic of society it's about you
it's about how you will be doing in twenty or thirty years
the yes man back in two thousand ten
outgrowth of the new york times what was the only good news
where it was the war is over
and again uh... energy crisis all environment protects
and insisted on over new york
and multiple use
the look on those people's faces as the red is wonderful stories
and you could see them breaking into tears
hands really just sandwell season didn't
isn't that ones