Watch videos with subtitles in your language, upload your videos, create your own subtitles! Click here to learn more on "how to Dotsub"

¿Cuál es su Relación con Jesús? (Pregunta al Padre Thomas Keating)

0 (0 Likes / 0 Dislikes)
[RETURN TO THE HEART OF CHRIST CONSCIOUSNESS FATHER THOMAS KEATING] [WHAT IS YOUR RELATIONSHIP TO JESUS?] The perspective I'd like to present Jesus in is that I have known Him from fairly early childhood. I failed Him very often and been forgiven over and over again. I have no credentials at all, except the one that really means most to me anyway, which is that God has chosen you. And as Paul says, He chooses the weakest things and the worst things sometimes to accomplish His major things, just so we realize it's not we who are doing anything great but that the manifestation of God is taking place in us. So that requires just a little context, and I heard it not long ago from Richard Roy, I don't know whether it was his idea or someone he was quoting, but the Trinity as understood in the Christian tradition or which is becoming better understood in the Christian tradition is about three relationships to ultimate reality, a transcended one whom Christian theology has called Father. The Father is absolute nothingness that is to say every possibility. If He was something, He could not be the ultimate reality. But He's not the whole of ultimate reality. His infinite possibilities express themselves in His Son which is the activization of every possibility in the Father so that the Son is absolutely everything, but the Father in giving himself away is so complete in His self-gift, His self-love, His self-sacrifice that as Panikkar points out in his theology and I think in the rhythm of being the Father, there's nothing left of the Father. In other words, He gives Himself away so infinitely that there's only sheer nothingness left in some mysterious combination of realities, not circumstances. So the Son then receives absolutely everything He is, the wholeness of the Father, the whole divinity with His glory and honor, and He gives Himself away with the same absoluteness back to the Father but at the same time, He overflows into creation by emptying Himself. So the same kenosis or emptying that the Father experiences is repeated in the Son from a different perspective. So the reality now is beginning to expand infinitely and beyond any consideration. And it's just awesome, this is being which is more becoming than being as Panikkar also suggests is not only awesome but overwhelming in the sense that... Rudolf Otto, I think it was who... That gave God the nickname of Mysterium Tremendum et Fascinans, which is Latin for the overwhelming mystery that is at the same time fascinating or irresistible. So we are brought in through the emptying of the Son in to a thou, you might say, in which God the Father calls us and becomes the Great I Am of the revelation to Moses in Exodus, the great Jewish scripture. When he was asked his name by Moses, Yahweh or God said, "I am that I am." In other words, I'm unlimited being or I'm unlimited becoming all the time. And I want to enter in to this relationship with you in particular and with the whole human family and all creation that is out there to prepare for this time or this moment when you can relate to me in the same spirit of emptying, and letting go, and manifesting, and humbling ourselves in the presence of the Creator. So there's nothing to us except that we're created. And yet it's perhaps the greatest of God's manifestations but at the same time as we know science suggests there might be other cosmoses with a different set of manifesting this being of God which is always becoming manifested through the astrophysics by the expansion of the universe in every direction at millions of miles an hour. So if all of this cosmos and God only knows where it's going, we don't know what's out there before it arrives, came out of this big bang according to most scientific thoughts, at least to this particular cosmos, there could be others is manifesting the very heart of God and His love or His goodness that wants to pour out unceasingly and everlastingly this sheer goodness, and affection, and love according to the capacity of each creature to perceive it so consciousness is perhaps all there is. But it's not self-consciousness, it's God manifesting himself, herself or itself. Incidentally I, we, or it are all aspects of the same reality. We need to be comfortable in each role. And so when we... My experience was that I had with given relationship with God in all these lower forms of human development such as parent-child, beautiful at itself but not ultimate, friend, companion, soulmate, bride or bridegroom, beloved, and now where is it going from here? Each relationship is possible and the stepping stone to even greater union, communion, and unity. So that the concerns of humanity or manifest the fact that it hasn't understood this divine love up till now. So Jesus then, for me, is the expression of God's infinite humility, His willingness not to be God. He's got everything so He doesn't care about having anything. He totally non-potest, totally at the disposal of everything, and perhaps has no self-consciousness but is simply living by what happens as He continues to create the cosmos nanosecond by nanosecond. And the revelation of Jesus is that He comes in to the world and identifies with our weakness, blindness, developmental processes, and the harm that are partial aspects of functioning or free choice but the only real freedom is God. And it's this that He offers us along with His love if we consent. So it's the consent that is crucial, not the activity, though the activity once we've consent it will be inspired by the third person in the Trinity who is maybe he's not a person but a relationship and is perhaps the infinite sacrificial love that's beyond anything we understand by love, a love that is beyond love, you might say. And so that's why my relating to Jesus at this point is with His nothingness because that is what gives you everything. And at the same time, gives it to you in such a way that you don't care either who is your manifestation of God's pure love. And He asks us to share this infinite mercy we receive in Him so far as we as we can. So the entrance of the word of God, the Son of God into humanity means that God has totally identified with the consciousness of humanity exactly where it is and brings us or intends to bring us gradually through our falls and blindness, ignorance, and here we should emphasize, our lack of evolution. So our guilt feelings that are coming if they haven't been induced by... Unfortunately zealous preachers who are threatening us sometimes with punishment, no, there's no punishment in God, there are sanctions for doing things that are contrary to the natural order that you have to work out or work through, but everything is this incredible love because there's no selfishness at all in God. There's no self-consideration, there's simply life and love, infinite compassion, kindness, tenderness... Patience, and the desire to love us completely into being to such a degree that we can consciously enter the kingdom of heaven, which is in other words, it's the Christian word for the development of consciousness. So the love of Christ that is passionate, this takes place in one of the earlier relationships, it's of tremendous value because it brings together the human emotional system in a way that God can experience what it's like to be a human being and what the intensity of the emotions are, and through Jesus Christ to feel the ultimate weakness, the agony that God. He said, the spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak and prayed that the sufferings ahead of Him, He might be spared off. But that means that He felt to that very bottom the consequences of the human condition and weakness when it goes into deliberate sin and then you have consequences, the psychological nature that's only the love of God can heal. So it's this experience of God's love of the mercy of God, of the everlasting character of God's love, and in deep mediation or prayer, one silence begins to morph into presence, an interior presence, which we don't know how to identify in this. We've been instructed to do so as God but is the mystery of ultimate reality and that isn't stopping at communion between us and God as marvelous as that's relation is calling us in to unity at consciousness. Jesus speaks of this with great openness in His priestly prayer at the last supper. We're to become one with God. In other words, enter in to the bosom of the Trinity and experience what Christ experiences in the way of the divine dispositions. And this inkling, usually the experience of complete silence is rare. Otherwise you'd already be in the kingdom of God and in heaven. It's presented to us with the greatest intimacy. And so to think of God as separate from us is perhaps more painful to God than any of our other attitudes or our sins itself because it means we don't trust Him, we don't trust the love that is infinitely directed towards our needs. And so to sum up... What I'm bouncing around doing with what seems to me to be little success or whatever the experience of God is, it's slippery, it's easily absorbed by the senses which are necessary means or stepping stones to the grow and the human development of relating evermore profoundly or completely or easily or delightfully to the divine becoming. So we'll probably always be becoming and growing in the heavenly kingdom. But you might say the spiritual life as a consent to God's plan might go something like this. The first step is to become aware that there is this other capital owe, that is there is a presence, an ultimate mystery, an ultimate reality or something beyond being or non-being the I am that just is, is, is in every direction without any limit, without any time. And this... This extraordinary event... Or temporary consciousness alerts us to the fact that we are not alone that the humanity is not alone, the cosmos is not alone but is totally penetrated in the grandiose expressions and in the infinitesimal by the divine mystery that is absolutely unlimited. So to become aware that there is another that is a higher power, this starts us off in looking for some kind of guide or guru or religion or nature or other very profound human experiences like the heroic service of others and care, conjugal love, all of these things are speaking not from themselves alone but from the mystery of God within them that gives full role to the gift that they can bring to us of human experience and of human life to this process of getting to know the other. As Jesus said, we must know the Father and Jesus Christ whom He has sent, remember the sending consists in the consenting of these aspects of the Trinity to total sacrifice of their honor, prestige, they don't need thanks, they don't care about being God, they just want to incorporate us as conscious creatures into this program of establishing kingdom of infinite love for the consciousness of infinite tenderness. So what will happen if we continue to pursue our knowledge of the other through human beings, imagination, experience, relationships on the human level, service, respect for rest of creation, all those things are myriad factors that are training us or preparing our psyche with its enormous complexity for the experience of the ultimate reality. So to know there is another, the next step is to become the other and this is the meaning of the Christian aestheticism of imitating Christ. It's to become not so much as external activities but the interior disposition of total dedication to Father and total service, and love, and identification with humans in their most desperate spiritual poverty in disposition. Remember He said, "I've come to save what was lost." The Aramaic word here means totally lost, blasted, evaporated, crushed, nothing left. It's the desperate people who are, and I guess we're all desperate, are calling out to this infinite tenderness, compassion, and love of God that has no end. As the psalm says, "His love is everlasting." So why think of His punishment? There is no punishment in love. It's simply a little disappointment and then you try to rebuild whatever the relationship was. So to become the other means that at some point you are the other as you go through the adventure of human life in a purified in the interior and the external fires of tribulations of this world, and there are special ways, at least in my experience, where God, Jesus has made Himself, Jesus acting of course as God here, as the most superb psychotherapist or analyst there ever was, knows everything about us and still loves us infinitely and with great patience awaits us to have the courage or humility or trust in Him to be able to look our faults in the face and say. yes, I have these feelings of all the human disabilities, this jealousy, envy, lust, pride especially, which wants to dominate others. All these things are obstacles to perfect happiness. And so in the becoming process of imitating God or of Christ or whatever the higher power is for you, you begin to be those things. In other words, in the Christian scheme of things, you receive the sacraments into being the sacraments, you receive the Eucharist to be the Eucharist so that at some point you are the Eucharist radiating the divine presence wherever you go without thinking about it, just by being what level of yourself you are becoming. And finally there's a final stage which is there is no other capital owe... We have disappeared into our own nothingness as creatures and allowed God to give us everything, which is Himself. And this is a big project. And what I'm doing now is just becoming nothing. All I'm interested in doing is that coming from great love of Jesus will only He knows or can judge that. But all I would want to do is to let go, let go, and let go following Jesus' invitation in one of the synoptic gospels, which to me is one of the most important wisdom sayings. And it comes after some vocational discussion with somebody who didn't make it, who didn't want to follow Christ, who didn't want to become Christ yet, he had a few other things that he wanted to do apparently. And Jesus says, "If you want to save your life." And in that context, it certainly means your false self, your illusory life, the life your created not I in your childhood by looking for programs or happiness that would satisfy your instinctual needs, not that they're bad but that they have to be in proportion with the other values of human nature as we grow. But here, to be one means, I don't know, and if anybody knows they probably should keep their mouth shut but it's the destiny that is incredible. It's not available to human reason. It is available to the opening of the human heart to the mystery of God's presence. And as our silence morphs in to that experience, which is beyond the senses or the rational process, it doesn't reject them or destroy them but simply provides a new perspective, the divine perspective on all reality so that God begins to peek out at us from all sense experiences and it's present in people in spite of their personality problems, is not surprised by the disasters of this complicated universe. It is not making any demands, it simply is not even just being but is always becoming, becoming, and forgetful of self. So what Jesus is saying is that if you really try to save your that false self life, your ego self, you'll bring yourself to ruin, won't get anywhere. You may have many opportunities. God gives us millions of billions of chances and never holds any fault against us. But that move within... Of Jesus' saying goes on to say but anyone that is anyone at all that everybody who is a human being is a candidate for this and has the resources to do it if they will take the trouble to learn how to consent to God's action, to God's becoming in our life and to let God be God in us. And so He says anyone at all who brings himself, herself to nothing will find out who they are and who are they. Who are they? Who are we at the deepest level? Have we a self at all or are we really the manifestation of the divine manifesting itself as divine and as human at the same time? So the plan is to be God in the humblest kinds of ways that seems to be appropriate for this life. So why not, at least that's my philosophy, why not put everything into it that you have in the way human resources? Not to be yourself, not to become better, but just to become what you are. So we then become empty, emptied out like the Father and Jesus, and in that sense, as we become no thing, no particular objects, no possession, no attachment to ourselves, but we just can be, then there's no separation at all. Everything is one without ceasing to be multiple. That's something only God can do. He loves to be everything at once. So you can't say one thing about God without saying the other or maybe an infinite number of other things. This is an extraordinary life, a marvelous universe, and the fact that is plagued with evil manifests how humble God is that He lets His creation get into such methods from time to time to allow anything to happen, but with always the same purpose of finally getting us to allow Him to love us. And that is not an effort because it already is happening.

Video Details

Duration: 31 minutes and 19 seconds
Year: 2015
Country: United States
Language: English
License: Dotsub - Standard License
Views: 84
Posted by: castella on Oct 12, 2016

El Padre Thomas Keating describe distintos aspectos de su propia relación con Jesús, a petición del Integral Institute.

Caption and Translate

    Sign In/Register for Dotsub to translate this video.