... my main occupation. - You've mentioned that it suits you, that you don't depend on anyone, that you don't depend on electricity, and that you don't depend on the market. Does that have something to do with the situation that we have been in in the past 10 years? - That we were in and that we are in still, hm. The situation that doesn't suit me in any sense. We could talk a lot about that. These times don't suit me personally. And this is probably my little escape from those times, and it feels good. Yes, that's it. - Let's get back to the music a bit. You have a band now. - About 2-3 years ago, my younger son, Milos, was talking to his friends and, as those conversations among the young people go, like: "Do you have a band?" The guy says: "Yes." "I don't." And so on, you know, it's simply a popular thing. They asked Milos: "Do you have a band?" He said: "I don't, but my father does." You know, with a lot of humor and joke. Hm, and that's how it really was. At that time I had a band, and they didn't. Ljubinko was at the college, and Milos didn't have a band at the time, though he has affinity for it. And we've made the band sometime in the 70's. Namely, yes, this band is from '66. But we grew older, got married, and that period kind of stopped. And then that same crew again got a wish to... to start something, so at that time we took the tambourines. That was very interesting to us. Tambourine is an acoustic string instrument. Here, in this area, it's very popular, just like the guitar is in Spain, like mandolin is in Italy, and whatever. Our tambourine is a main instrument for us. And that was a nice time spent with the tambourine. Maybe that's when Ljubinko got 'infected'. And, hm... and that lasted, I don't know, about 10 years. But we got kind of fed up with that too. So, again, for the third time, we got back to electric guitars and drums. I guess we got fed up even with a thought of old day amplifiers that were weak, and broken, and of many cables that we used to braze, stick with matches, and god-knows-what, tortured our selves... bad mikes, bad sound system. Now it's all, hm... it's not such a big problem to get the sound system, nor is it so expensive anymore, it seems to me, so we got a wish to turn back to the rock music again. Actually, it's not exactly rock, more like some kind of pop-rock, if you get me, mostly Serbian. And, so, that's our pastime. - Are most of your close friends in that band or do you also have friends which are not into music? - Long time ago someone said that it's... hard to put together 4 good friends, like really good, and to put together 4 friends that are into music, that is really difficult. It's the same now-a-days. We're different people and different characters. Hm, sometimes we disagree. Everyone's got his own vision. The worst thing is that we're just amateurs in all of it, so, I guess in that weakness and ignorance, it's all even harder. But again, socializing and playing music is... it stays forever, permanently, and we endure in it. - You've mentioned the other day, when we talked, the feeling of sleeping between 2 millions of bees. Can you tell us something about that? - That happened to me when I, hm, moved my bees into a container for the first time. Namely, a big problem of every bee keeper is pasturage. I mean, there where you have... where your stationary is, you usually don't have all kinds of pasturage that you would like, which means having a spring pasturage, and acacia, and linden, and sunflower. It's hard to achieve that kind of... that kind of place, that kind of stationary. So, the bee keepers find a way, and there's a very old saying: Honey's made on the shaft. That means that you have to move the bees, to carry them. People say that before they used to carry them on the ox carts, I don't know. Today it's a bit different. People make, improvise trucks, improvise side cars, buses even... old buses... they move the hives in, and that's how they can get to any pasturage. So, I made a container for myself. That means... it's on its own 4 legs. A little truck, 2 tones, comes in reverse under it. I use the lifter, put the container down on the truck. We go to the field, put it down there, put the legs down, the truck leaves, and I stay. And, hm, there's enough space in that container to stay in naturally, so I've slept in that container on the first night together with my bees. And that... I remember that feeling even now, when I lied down in that corridor.The hives were practically on my left and right side. Practically 50-60 cm away from my head on both sides. And I imagined in my head, thought -- each hive, the theory says, had between 20 and 50.000 bees, let's say 30 or 40. I have 32 hives. I counted it proximately, 1.300.000 around me, and I'm alone. I can tell you it's really a good feeling. All the time you have that beautiful smell of theirs, that sound of bees, we say almost like murmur, and that's an exceptional feeling. - Are you a religious man? - Well, I don't know. As they say, an agnostic. I am actually an Orthodox agnostic. What can I say, I doubt everything. Simply, I've became suspicious as years went by I guess, so, hm... but the Orthodoxy is very familiar to me, Orthodox faith. I felt good in the period when I was attending our local church. I was singing in the choir, and that kind of music is very beautiful. It lasted for about two, maybe three years. And I said I'll come again eventually, and I probably will. - Is that doubt maybe connected to the upbringing during our communism? Or, what was the position of people on religion during communism? - I'll tell you about my closest surroundings. My father... I think he wasn't religious, as I remember, as I know. My mother's father, with whom I grew up, and my grandmother were, so to say, partially... I don't know how to put it, partially religious. They also had a positive understanding of Orthodoxy, but we didn't go to church regularly. So... we respected tradition, we respected that church tradition too. And that's how I experienced that period. In the society, well we all know that now, partially it, hm... it wasn't welcomed. People thought that the church has some, not backward, but maybe you could say non-progressive views on life, on life which was then, in that period, in a great uprising, I think, at least the material one. Hm, but... Well, that's the surrounding in which I grew up. Later I... And I wasn't a believer at all. Later I had a need, I simply had a need to discover something in it, to realize something, to experience something. And, as I said, I was... I attended church regularly on Sunday, for the liturgy. I sang, so I was... I was actively involved in it, but, I admit, I didn't experience what I think... and what those real believers, how can I put it, experience. I didn't make it. I don't know if I should be sorry about it or not, but I didn't experience it. - What's your opinion about that sudden boom of religion after the dissolution of a socialist country and after the war that took many lives, and after the complete change of the political understanding of the religion itself? - Some say that it was fashionable. Some say it was one... there was probably a void that people needed to fill. People tried, maybe the same as I did, to fill that void with faith. That's what I think happened at that time, and that's why that, how can I say, sudden popularity of church, and that's why people suddenly turned to that. So, it was a mixture of everything. Everyone has their own reason. And now it's probably... again, of course, people kind of sober up, as always. I still think that I'll make it sooner or later. I see it as... simply as my... not task, but... I still think I'll find something in it. I can't explain it. For now, I leave that to time, I leave that to time... - Till now, in your life, were you a happy man? - Very, I could say. Very, I could say. First thing that comes to my mind is family. And with that only I'm already completely pleased, primarily with my children. I'm exceptionally, exceptionally pleased with my sons. And that could... What else? What's necessary? Well, nothing else is necessary. - Thank you.